Super Episode 125 (28 January 2018)

[Doctor.]

The episode was alright, I suppose. Freeza's beatdown was entertaining to watch and Toppo is imposing, though I think it's dumb that a title like God of Destruction is now a completely new transformation for... some reason. Like I said in another thread, it doesn't go well with the fact that Beerus is a God of Destruction and can use Hakai without any changes to his physical appearance (the same with UI for Beerus/Whis in comparison to Goku's appearance change, but that's another story). Toppo making his "choice" and forsaking justice for the sake of becoming a God of Destruction, someone beyond good and evil, is a neat idea... on paper, if not for the fact that it was already done in the tournament itself; he had already told Dyspo that there is no such thing as justice, only survival, 20 episodes ago. The structural problems of the ToP (and the lack of coordination between the writers) rears its ugly head again.

I liked the fact that #17 keeps getting focus, even if his present characterization is inconsistent with the way he was in the Cell arc. His barrier getting cracked would have more weight if not for the fact that it already got destroyed by a weakling like Ribrianne, of all people. I disliked how the entire episode was basically one big Namek arc reference, too. I hope they do more with Freeza by the time the arc ends.

[lancerman]

What a bad, bad episode. It's episodes like these why I think it's better that Super (at least temporarily) calls it quits.

With only 6 episodes left we get the same horrible tropes we've seen far too much:

-Character getting a random ass powerup out of nowhere to prolong the fight.
-People at the bench constantly explaining everything in order to fill up running time
-Time progressing as slow as possible. This normally doesn't bother me but when a character has a tactic where he plans to stall in order to let the team win it falls flat when one minute seems to last one episode. Reminded me of Namek's "one minute until the planet explodes".
-No eliminations even though characters clearly CAN eliminate someone.
-Filler fighting. Fighting without any progress in story or characters, meaning the Jiren/Goku/Vegeta fight. That fight didn't progress at all
-Forced references to earlier Dragonball.

What I did like however were the interactions between Toppo/Freeza/17. 17 Really shined in this episodes and I'm glad this character got a second chance in Super. Freeza was pretty entertaining when the tables were turned.

Wow. There’s always at least one person who finds a lotto complain about. I have things that I dislike about the series, but this is a whole other level. This was one of the better episodes in Super (despite questionable moments) but I still enjoyed it.

If you’re gonna do this kind of complaining why are you even here?

I'm convinced there's certain people that would be hating on Dragon Ball or Dragon Ball Z if it were coming out now in Super's place.

[Polyphase Avatron]

Comments on this episode:

- Interesting how Jiren deflected that Final Flash with his eye attack... I guess it was weaker than the previous one since it wasn't charged nearly as much
- Well for all you know, Vegeta, maybe his species doesn't sweat?
- Am I just having deja vu here, or did Beerus do the whole correcting himself and addressing Gohan by his name before already?
- So I guess in order to exploit his infinite energy/stamina, 17 has to use weaker attacks? Because if it was truly infinite, couldn't he just spam his strongest attacks in the same way? Kind of confusing.
- This beam clash reminds me of the Gohan vs. Cell Kamehameha clash somewhat, especially with Freeza taking on the role of Vegeta and attacking Toppo in the back
- So Whis has to check the bench to make sure Toppo is out, he can't tell what happened in the arena better than anyone else?
- Freeza should stop boasting and just knock him off... he had the chance
- At first I was thinking that Belmod would transfer his title/power to Toppo, but Toppo is just gaining it on his own? I don't see how it makes sense for there to be two Hakaishin for the same universe like that
- I thought 17 couldn't sense ki, so what does he mean by "this sensation"?
- So did Toppo's aura disintegrate/destroy Freeza's attack, or did he use a nullification move like Beerus? They look different so I'm assuming the former
- If Freeza really believed that, he wouldn't be scared of Beerus...
- If Toppo is actually trying to kill Freeza, doesn't he realize that would get him disqualified? Then it would be 3 on 1 against Jiren.
- So is Toppo just stronger than Sidra, or was Sidra's power diluted since it was used through a proxy?
- This is a pretty intense scene, I like it. I don't get why the sky changed, though. We know Daishinkan can change it but hakai energy can also change it? Weird.
- So if becoming a Hakaishin increases the power of his normal attacks so much, why even bother with a hakai attack and risk getting disqualified?
- Well they could still do what they did to Botamo... or I think a strong enough attack can break that aura since we saw Freeza resist it when used offensively
- Wait, if he's completely surrounded by that Hakaishin ki, why isn't the rock he's standing on disintegrating?
- I guess maybe he's using the projectile version of the hakai technique instead of the direct version (like what Beerus did to Zamasu) because there's a better chance his targets will survive it and he won't get disqualified? Come to think of it, at this point it hasn't been confirmed that Freeza is still alive, so why isn't he being considered for disqualification already like Jiren and Goku were after the Genki Dama?
- I guess the charge time is due to him being a new/inexperienced Hakaishin
- So a hakai attack can be dispersed by throwing rocks or something else at it for it to disintegrate? Seems kind of underwhelming
- Freeza's pose and expression here also remind me of after he came back from the Genki Dama on Namek
- So is Freeza implying that all of his previous attacks so far (and most of the other attacks used in the tournament) weren't powerful enough to destroy a planet? Meh, just another inconsistency I suppose. Still it's nice to see him use the Death Ball again.
- Finally the disqualification is mentioned... why was he trying to destroy 17 and Freeza before, then? He even mentioned being surprised that Freeza survived, indicating he intended to kill him
- So I guess the next strategy will be trying to throw rocks at Toppo hoping they will use up his hakai energy leaving him vulnerable...
- It seems like the narrator is also implying that Freeza > 17, which I would agree with

Best episode in a while IMO

[TheOtherDude]

Hey farmer with a shotgun was, he can't do it..
Come to think of it Yamcha can't either, actually, any of the humans are debatable..
To put it simply, planet busting attacks are still a big thing, it might not be for the people on the stage right now, not even gonna try to defend that, but it's still not something every other guy can pull off..

Then your point is wrong because a) "every idiot" is a commonly used hyperbole and b) I do not know how you come to the conclusion that is a fact Yamcha cannot do it or the rest. They all even trained for the Cyborgs. And anime-wise they are even a lot stronger.

Planet busting is NOT a big deal anymore. They have been blowing up planets since the Saiyan saga. One of the most iconic moments in dragon ball was Vegetas Galic Gun vs Goku Kamehameha. That was a planet busting attack.

Everyone is past the level Vegeta was at in the Saiyan Saga. They are capable of blowing up planets. Before you even try to challenge that statement, why would Krillin Yamcha or Tien have a reason to try and blow up a planet?

[Sandubadear]

Toppo making his "choice" and forsaking justice for the sake of becoming a God of Destruction, someone beyond good and evil, is a neat idea... on paper, if not for the fact that it was already done in the tournament itself; he had already told Dyspo that there is no such thing as justice, only survival, 20 episodes ago.

It's one thing to say, another thing to fully believe it.

[Doctor.]

Toppo making his "choice" and forsaking justice for the sake of becoming a God of Destruction, someone beyond good and evil, is a neat idea... on paper, if not for the fact that it was already done in the tournament itself; he had already told Dyspo that there is no such thing as justice, only survival, 20 episodes ago.

It's one thing to say, another thing to fully believe it.

It doesn't really matter considering they didn't portray it well. They just seemed to ignore that moment existed. Toppo starts shouting JUSTICE again the episodes after he said that for the first time.

[OLKv3]

Do you think this is a spoiler?

https://youtu.be/vJme7IVFSEw
(0.00-0.10)

Yes, people have took it as the final three for months now

[sintzu]

Do you think this is a spoiler?

https://youtu.be/vJme7IVFSEw
(0.00-0.10)

Yes, people have took it as the final three for months now

People also thought Gohan would be in the final 3 because of the ending he showed up in with Goku. If Freeza stays down then I can see that happening but I think there's an episode preview saying he fights again next week (or the week after).

[Cetra]

Planet busting is NOT a big deal anymore. They have been blowing up planets since the Saiyan saga. One of the most iconic moments in dragon ball was Vegetas Galic Gun vs Goku Kamehameha. That was a planet busting attack.

Everyone is past the level Vegeta was at in the Saiyan Saga. They are capable of blowing up planets. Before you even try to challenge that statement, why would Krillin Yamcha or Tien have a reason to try and blow up a planet?

Please do not reply to posts you have never read. I am the one that was saying that it is not a big deal so do not answer like i said the opposite. I do not need to "challenge" anything because you are trying to contradict what I was saying with exactly what I was saying. That it is nothing for all those people, nothing special anymore. Whether they "would want to do that" is not the question of the day but their capability alone.

[TheOtherDude]

Planet busting is NOT a big deal anymore. They have been blowing up planets since the Saiyan saga. One of the most iconic moments in dragon ball was Vegetas Galic Gun vs Goku Kamehameha. That was a planet busting attack.

Everyone is past the level Vegeta was at in the Saiyan Saga. They are capable of blowing up planets. Before you even try to challenge that statement, why would Krillin Yamcha or Tien have a reason to try and blow up a planet?

Please do not reply to posts you have never read. I am the one that was saying that it is not a big deal so do not answer like i said the opposite. I do not need to "challenge" anything because you are trying to contradict what I was saying with exactly what I was saying. That it is nothing for all those people, nothing special anymore. Whether they "would want to do that" is not the question of the day but their capability alone.

The Post OBVIOUSLY wasn’t for you. It was for the person you quoted. Use common sense next time.

[Cetra]

The Post OBVIOUSLY wasn’t for you. It was for the person you quoted. Use common sense next time.

That's rich coming from you. Why did you not use the "common sense" you have and quoted him alone instead of me? His post is just like 2 posts above mine or so.

[TheOtherDude]

The Post OBVIOUSLY wasn’t for you. It was for the person you quoted. Use common sense next time.

That's rich coming from you. Why did you not use the "common sense" you have and quoted him alone instead of me? His post is just like 2 posts above mine or so.

I thought you would’ve appreciated someone siding with you, but obviously I thought wrong

[fadeddreams5]

I think 17 just won Uni 7 the whole tournament by not letting Frieza fall out. The last two battles will be between Vegeta and Toppo, and Goku and Jiren. I think both fights will result in draws/double ring outs, meaning Uni 7 will win thanks to an unconscious Frieza still remaining in the ring.

The episode was alright, I suppose. Freeza's beatdown was entertaining to watch and Toppo is imposing, though I think it's dumb that a title like God of Destruction is now a completely new transformation for... some reason. Like I said in another thread, it doesn't go well with the fact that Beerus is a God of Destruction and can use Hakai without any changes to his physical appearance (the same with UI for Beerus/Whis in comparison to Goku's appearance change, but that's another story).

Maybe all the GoDs have undergone transformations. It's just they're perpetually in their current states because they're full-time GoDs. Toppo is still borderline mortal. Makes him unique. =P

[Doctor.]

Maybe all the GoDs have undergone transformations. It's just they're perpetually in their current states because they're full-time GoDs. Toppo is still borderline mortal. Makes him unique. =P

Seems kinda stupid that Toppo gets a big, buff transformation with tattoos and a Hakai aura and all the other GoDs just chill in forms that aren't very imposing at all. All that tells me is that this is likely a Toei-only form, though I wouldn't put it past Toriyama considering UI changes Goku's appearance for some reason even though Beerus and Whis use it just fine.

[Acetona]

Eh
To be honest, I'm glad Super's ending. I'm at my limit, I can't stand these stupid references anymore. Freeza came back with his eyes closed after taking the Genki Da-- oops, Hakai and... 2 seconds later, his left eye is totaly unscathed. Can't they stop this stupidity already?

[ekrolo2]

Maybe all the GoDs have undergone transformations. It's just they're perpetually in their current states because they're full-time GoDs. Toppo is still borderline mortal. Makes him unique. =P

Seems kinda stupid that Toppo gets a big, buff transformation with tattoos and a Hakai aura and all the other GoDs just chill in forms that aren't very imposing at all. All that tells me is that this is likely a Toei-only form, though I wouldn't put it past Toriyama considering UI changes Goku's appearance for some reason even though Beerus and Whis use it just fine.

It's not impossible that it's a a Toei only thing or Toei exaggarating something for more "omph". In the manga Trunks just has SS2 but with a bigger multiplier whereas the anime gives him something similar with SSRage that acts as its own form. In the manga, Toppo already kind of powers up with God ki during his match against Goku so this could be a similar case where something that's not a big visual change is exaggerated in the anime to look cooler.

[dbgtFO]

All that tells me is that this is likely a Toei-only form, though I wouldn't put it past Toriyama considering UI changes Goku's appearance for some reason even though Beerus and Whis use it just fine.

Toriyama probably had to make it a transformation, because it has become so entrenched in the franchise that Saiyans just transforms, but he compromised by giving it minimal changes, so it can basically work like an updated version of Ultimate with not straying far from the original state, but drawing out all power more efficiently than the forms before it.
I doubt GoD transformation Toppo is a Toriyama thing, but we will see.

[RedHeat]

Eh
To be honest, I'm glad Super's ending. I'm at my limit, I can't stand these stupid references anymore. Freeza came back with his eyes closed after taking the Genki Da-- oops, Hakai and... 2 seconds later, his left eye is totaly unscathed. Can't they stop this stupidity already?

But it looks cool.

[DragonBallFoodie]

The action was pretty impressive this episode.

Toppo looks like he just snapped or jumped off a slippery slope. He unleashed his God of Destruction status and forsook justice, it's terrifying and maybe tragic.

He gave a very satisfactory beatdown to Freeza though. And Android 17's hand slip is priceless.

Someone should have called out Bermod on using Hakaishin powers in the tournament, but Zeno probably wouldn't care.

[Saturnine]

It really isn't, planet busting isn't a feat every fighter can do, if they can, it's still not an easy task for most, that's an incredible amount of energy and to throw that at one individual isn't a joke either..

Tien did the best he can against cell to the point of nearly dying, he fired all his ki in the ground, didn't destroy the planet then..
Freeza was the first casual planet destroyer, he was SS tier, unless you believe humans are above SS tier then no, pulling off a planet busting attack is a big task if at all possible..

Well, anyway, that was meant as a light-hearted comment, I could continue with this but I would rather not, arguments on power levels aren't the best ones to get into

The moon is a planet too, and we all know how little it took to bust it. Also, Vegeta's Galick Gun on Earth was said to be able to destroy the planet.